We are thrilled to have Dr. Ravindra Nanda as our guest on the podcast. During our conversation, Dr. Nanda will explore groundbreaking advancements in the field of aligner orthodontics. He will provide insights into the innovative technology enabling orthodontists to sustainably produce aligners in their offices. While minimal training is needed, the mechanics behind this process are remarkably straightforward. It's never been a better time to be an orthodontist.
IN THIS EPISODE:
KEY TAKEAWAYS:
Achieving practice growth isn’t as simple as it used to be. But with groundbreaking technology and new communication channels to reach more patients, People + Practice is an orthodontic marketing agency that firmly believes that there’s never been a better time to be in practice.
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
What follows is an AI-generated transcript. The transcript may contain errors and is not a substitute for watching the video.
Episode 52 - Dr. Ravindra Nanda & Direct 3D Printed Aligners From Graphy-Transcript
(00:00:00) Dr. Leon Klempner: So I think this is my 40th year at the, uh, AAO meeting. Uh, this year it was in Chicago and I'm like a kid in candy store. When I go to these shows, I go to the exhibits and I just love looking at the technologies. And I think our clients appreciate the fact that, you know, we bring these ideas back. Um, so, you know, I was walking around and I came across this company way in the back.
I was actually going to look for some popcorn. And the writing was in old Korean, but what I made out in English was that they were direct printing aligners. And I said, wait a minute, you know, I mean, that's going to be in the future, right? So, uh, I started, when I got back home, I Googled the company, I think it was called Grafee, and I saw that Dr.
Ravi Nanda was lecturing on some of these ideas. Now, this guy knows his (00:01:00) stuff, well respected, highly knowledgeable, so I called Ravi and I asked him if he'd come in and talk with us about it. And that's why we're here. So stay tuned and hear what he has to say.
(00:01:16) Narrator: The future of orthodontics is evolving and changing every day. But although the way to achieve practice growth has changed, there's never been a better time to be an orthodontist. Let's get into the minds of industry leaders, forward thinking orthodontists, and technology insiders to learn how they see the future of the orthodontic specialty.
Join your hosts Dr. Leon Klempner and Amy Epstein each month as they bring you insights, tips, and guest interviews focused on helping you capitalize on the opportunities for practice growth. And now, welcome to the Golden Age of Orthodontics with the co founders of People and Practice, Dr. Leon Klempner and Amy Epstein.
(00:01:58) Dr. Leon Klempner: Welcome to the Golden Age. (00:02:00) Orthodontics. I'm Leon Klentner, retired board certified orthodontist, the director and craniofacial orthodontist at the Icahn School of Medicine at Mount Sinai, part time faculty at the School of Dental Medicine at Harvard University, and of course, the CEO of People in Practice.
And I'm joined today, as usual,
with my daughter slash partner.
(00:02:28) Amy Epstein: Hello, I'm Amy. Thank you for that intro. Nice to be here today. I have marketing expertise and public relations expertise and we got together. And started a marketing consultancy for orthodontics, orthodontists, um, in order to help others in the field, merge real strong marketing tactics with strong knowledge of the orthodontic industry.
So I've been doing this for about 12 years now. And then we (00:03:00) started this podcast today. I'm thrilled that we're going to have Dr. Ravi Nanda on the show. There are very few times that I see my dad get, uh, stars in his eyes, and this was one of them when we started talking about our guest today. So Ravi Nanda is here to talk to us about direct digital printing.
Like my dad said, he saw this at the AAO. I was there too. He came back to me and said, this is, this is cool. We have to learn more about this. And Dr. Nanda knows a lot about this. He's incredibly qualified to speak on this topic. Let me just briefly tell you about his background. If you don't already know him, he's been active in orthodontic biomechanics, research, clinical trials, and the acceleration of ortho treatment throughout his entire career.
He's authored and coauthored over 300 scientific papers. He's the editor and in chief. Progress in orthodontics. He's also an associate editor of the J. C. O. He has authored and co (00:04:00) authored 10 textbooks. He's professor emeritus and former UConn alumni endowed chair, and he's the head of the Department of craniofacial sciences and the chair of the division of ortho at the UConn School of Dental Medicine.
Welcome Dr Nanda to the show. Thank you so much for being here with us today. We're very excited to talk with you. Thank you
(00:04:22) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: very much, Amy, and thank you, Leon, for a very kind introduction, and it's a great pleasure to be here. Wonderful to be here.
(00:04:32) Dr. Leon Klempner: Great. Yeah, we're so happy to have you, and Amy, just for your own information, Robbie and I go back a long way.
I think, I think it was Richie Faber who introduced us years ago. I don't quite remember. Richie and I were on the craniofacial team at Stony Brook for about 40 years together. Um, but, um, you know, Ravi's from Yukon. I went to Tufts. And when I was a resident, this was in the 70s, Ravi was (00:05:00) already at Yukon.
Uh, we would take some classes with the UConn students and at Tufts, we were kind of like a bread and butter kind of, of, of program. So um, you know, I'm going to talk geek stuff a minute, but you'll understand. So if I had to bend the wire to like intrude or move upper teeth up, I would put like a tip back bend in and I've showed to my instructor, he said, fine, and that would be the end of it.
Well, at UConn. They had rulers, measurements, gauges, they had everything to determine exactly how many grams of force. And what was the counter force? And how do we, how do we, you know, counteract the counter force? It's like, we were like, our eyes are like wide open. And, and Charlie Burstone, uh, who, who was like the father of biomechanics, together, uh, really, uh, pioneered this area and, and brought us.
You (00:06:00) know, into more of a scientific method. So Ravi, welcome. It's a pleasure to be here. I appreciate it. So, you know, the, the company I stumbled upon, I, uh, is called Graphy. And, uh, when I, tell me a little bit about how you first heard about them and how you got involved.
(00:06:19) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: I got involved, um, I would say about, uh, almost now two years ago and, um, uh, through my friend, uh, Kenji Ojima, who, uh, is a sort of pioneer in the area of, uh, aligners and he practices in Japan.
And he called me one day and he says, Ravi, you know, uh, there's this company where, uh, you can print aligners directly. And, uh, on top of that, uh, these aligners have a shape memory, uh, property. That excited me. And, uh, then the company got in touch with me (00:07:00) and, uh, since now I am retired, living in Florida, I told the company, okay, I will work with you, help you advance, uh, the technology.
So I've been working with them, uh, to improve the product and at the same time to introduce the product, um, Internationally. So the net result is you probably see on Facebook and Instagram. I'm almost in two or three countries a month, you know, so I sort of combine them and I'm enjoying this quite a bit.
And so we have come a long way. And so you can ask me questions and I'll go ahead and tell you what this
(00:07:42) Dr. Leon Klempner: is all about. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, first of all, um, Is it available in the United States or right now, uh, just, uh, internationally?
(00:07:55) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: It is available in the United States. Uh, it received its, (00:08:00) uh, FDA 501, uh, approval about eight months ago.
And, uh, there are two components, uh, to this product. One is that, uh, you can, uh, uh, create these aligners in house. Yourself and the second one is that, uh, a company can produce, uh, just like any other aligner company where you can send your scans and they will, uh, send you the finished product. So the second part in U.
(00:08:47) Dr. Leon Klempner: So, so, I mean, uh, an orthodontist can take a scan as it does now. Does it need to use like a special printer, um, in order to
(00:08:58) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: do so? (00:09:00) So, the process is very sensitive, okay?
So what you need is a 3D printer. And we recommend this Unix, uh, printer because, uh, the settings have been made accordingly. And then you take the resin, uh, the resin comes in these bottles, and you place the resin in the tray. And you plug in your software, whatever the changes you have made, the STL files, and then this plate will come down and touch the tray where the resin is, and then it will move up and in about 32 minutes you will have about six to ten aligners ready.
No No models. No, no Thermo farming , uh, no, no. Suck down, no nothing. You know, this is just amazing. I mean, when I saw this for the first (00:10:00) time, I said, my goodness, this is going to be the future. And then on top of that, uh, you know, the shape memory aspect, because I always tell that one of the things which really revolutionized orthodontics is when we brought shape memory allies.
into orthodontics. You know, when we brought nitinol, nitite, copper nitite, TMA, we completely changed. And the same thing is going to happen, I think, eventually with the shape memory aligners. I mean, we are Uh, we are so attuned to what the companies have been telling us and sending us. So there are so many advantages, uh, direct printing that, uh, uh, once, once you start, you, you, you, you just don't want to leave.
You wonder why you are not doing all this all this time. I mean, just imagine at this time you take a scan, you send it to the company and they send you (00:11:00) 50 or 60 aligners. You know, here you can decide how many you want to print. You want to print eight, you want to print six. As you go along, you can do that.
And it's a pretty fast process.
(00:11:14) Dr. Leon Klempner: So when you send it out, let's say, to have him, have him manufactured, um, can you give me an idea of like how much it costs to, to get an
(00:11:26) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: aligner? Right now in U. S., uh, Forresterbin in, um, in St. Louis is the only one doing it. And there are two or three other companies which will be, uh, offering, uh, these aligners also.
So I would say, uh, I, I personally don't know the cost, but, so, so much, but I have a feeling it will be, um, I would say somewhere around 15 or 16 per aligner. But the beauty of that is that you don't need as many aligners. Because (00:12:00) when you use your conventional aligner, you put it in the mouth, it does not fit in.
So all the companies are giving you these chewies, you know, so you bite on it. When you bite on it, what happens is that the gingival margins, the, the aligner just opens up and starts deforming. With this thing, you, you just put it a little bit in hot water. It becomes very, very soft, just like nickel titanium wires.
You put it in the mouth, you adapt it, and within 30 to 40 minutes, it just goes back to its original shape and original flexibility or stiffness. And then you take it out, you can put it back in after showing in the tap water a little bit. Hot water softens it. So this is the beauty because You can, adaptation is very good and the forces unbelievable, you know, it's like almost like one.
20th of the force, uh, (00:13:00) these, these aligners deliver just like nickel titanium wires, you know?
(00:13:06) Amy Epstein: So, for me, this, this sounds to me, I, I look at things always from a patient perspective or a parent perspective, because my job is to help practices who might move into this in the future, then market this technology that they're using to the community and say, like, we're doing this.
You know, you know, we're the future of orthodontics. You have to come here and here's how it benefits you. So from a, from a patient perspective, or even from a parent's perspective, let's say, what would the benefits be? Are there, you know, speed of treatment or fewer visits or, um, let's, let's not even touch on the environmental perspective.
Cause I want to pin that for an additional discussion, but just the apples to apples patient benefit, what, what would you say?
(00:13:54) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: All the things which you mentioned. Okay, so let's take a look at it. You, at this (00:14:00) time, you go to an orthodontist and he is going to take an impression and then he is going to send it somewhere and it will come back to him in a, in a sort of format where he has to approve the changes or accept the changes and then the STL, then you are going to get the aligners.
Here, what is going to happen is you go to an orthodontist. And, uh, if you, if you have time you sit in the waiting room for one hour or you go shopping and you come back and you have your eight or nine aligners ready to take it back home right away. You don't have to wait three weeks, four weeks. So that's number one, opinion standpoint.
The second is that any time you put a aligner, conventional aligner in the mouth, it doesn't fit in, it hangs down. So they give you a chewies. When you use the chewies, you... You're causing pain, and discomfort, and distortion of the, of the aligner. So that is not fun to do it in any case. (00:15:00) And then the force values are very, very high.
For example, you can have up to 800 grams of force, when you only need like 30 grams of force. So just figure it out, how little, a little force. And then what we can do is. We don't need too many attachments, attachments are ugly, you know, these days you put attachments on all the teeth and they change color and, and if you are Indian like me and like curry, you know, suddenly they become yellow, you know, they don't look good.
So, so we use very few attachments because the whole tooth acts like an attachment because right away it fits in and then things will start moving accordingly. We can add or subtract the material. I can make the aligner thicker in the back, lighter in the front. All sorts of things we can do. We can make, uh, bite plates, we can make, uh, functional appliances, we can make (00:16:00) aligners with the palatal arches.
So, so there are a lot of exciting things. And the biggest advantage is that you can make eight or nine aligners and then you can scan and make some more. Because you don't know how a patient will look like after six months. So it's just like changing wires. You don't give wires to a patient and say, please come back.
You know, these are your wires. This is how the things will be. We see the patients six weeks, eight weeks, and see how things are going on. So the progression is going to be much better. Bigger tooth movements, faster tooth movements, more adaptability. I
(00:16:40) Amy Epstein: mean, it sounds pretty, it sounds pretty amazing. I mean, I also wonder, you know, if the, you would.
See patients on a regular basis. But if there was a remote monitoring component, could you see them even less? And would there be even fewer appointments to have to come in for and, uh, less wait time to get (00:17:00) started? I mean, it seems like treatment overall could really be accelerated with this technology.
(00:17:06) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: Exactly. That's why, uh, this technology has taken over in a lot of countries. I mean, the question was asked why we haven't moved very fast in U. S. The reason for that is that, uh, FDA wants every software to be approved. So, in other words, let's say if a company, like for example, Archform, is just introduced this week, the software which is going to be used for graphing, and they are probably going to introduce then the aligners also.
So, if another company comes in, And if they want to use it, they have to again go for FDA approval. So right now we have resin approval with FDA. For us, the dentist is selling and selling the product. They are giving the courses. So this (00:18:00) is very important that. Orthodontists take these, uh, uh, one day, half a day course, because the system is very sensitive.
It's not something you just throw it in, product comes out, you know, you just have to follow very closely.
(00:18:20) Dr. Leon Klempner: Well, I can tell you that, I'm sorry, go ahead, Amy. No, no, no, go ahead. I was
(00:18:26) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: going to say that. I
think Amy's asking very nice questions, you know. Because she's asking from the point of view of what's in it for the patient, you
(00:18:38) Amy Epstein: know. Thank you. Thank you very much. Well, then I'll continue asking my one last question then since Dr. Nando prefers my questions to your questions, Dad. Um, is the, the environmental benefits.
Because, you know, the patient benefit in the environmental benefit too. We make our decisions not just based on how this will affect us, although it's a big priority, convenience (00:19:00) and efficacy, of course, but comfort. But, uh, also if we can make a decision that's better for the environment, that is a big factor in, in decision making now.
(00:19:10) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: Unbelievable. In my lectures, I always talk about that. If you say there are 5 million. Patients with aligners in the world at this time, that means at least 150 million models are being thrown somewhere in the environment. And you can see 150 million aligners in the plastic is being thrown into the environment.
And if you are doing on the models, you are cutting that plastic. So we are polluting. Like crazy, this is a simple process, you know, all you're going to be polluting would be with the aligner, which you are going to be getting rid of, and we are going to tell our patients how to get rid of those aligners, you know, because right (00:20:00) now, nobody talks about it, you know, you give the aligners, you forget about it.
And I think we want to be very cognizant to the fact that we want to do something with those aligners afterwards.
(00:20:13) Amy Epstein: For sure. And I think also a bit of education on the patient and parent side about the manufacturing process and what, what the standard is right now and what the standard means for the environment and that there is another option.
If there's another option out there that avoids all that waste. It's something to seriously consider as a decision maker, as a parent, you know, it is an
(00:20:36) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: uphill task. Remember, all these companies are huge companies. There is always a pushback. Oh, this thing doesn't work. The product is no good. This thing goes wrong.
This thing goes, this is going to happen. But, you know, I've been in this business for a long time and I've seen things change, but sometimes they change slowly. (00:21:00) Companies are going to adapt, but I think this, this is a major revolutionary change in orthodontics, especially in aligner orthodontics. And the companies do not talk about it.
One of the lectures, which I always give is the efficacy of conventional aligners is very bad because about 40 to 50 percent of the correction never takes place. The easiest correction is in the front sixteenth, because you can move them forward, you move them back. And then people are very happy, but if you want to do torquing, if you want to do rotations, it doesn't happen.
The paper after paper is being published in the literature, which is telling people the efficacy of the conventional aligners is very, very bad, it's not good. But what happens is that sometimes economy takes over and convenience (00:22:00) takes over over the final results. And my job always is to remind orthodontists that, uh, that, you know, we are health workers and we should provide the patient the best possible treatment.
That's the way I look at it.
(00:22:17) Dr. Leon Klempner: So Ravi, I think, uh, what I should do is, uh, fly down to Florida. Get a place near you and then you and I open up a little office. We'll do some exams, uh, we'll, we'll use these aligners. We'll use dental monitoring to do the marketing. We'll have, we'll start a little thing. I think it could do well anyway.
Um, all kidding aside, um, each year, uh, on each episode we have, uh, it's our tradition to have a caller, uh, ask a question. And this time I asked. Uh, I asked, uh, Richie Faber, I knew that, that he would strike, uh, a chord with you. So let's ask, let's (00:23:00) see what Richie has to say. Sure.
(00:23:03) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: I'm very interested in this topic that you're talking about.
And, um, I think everybody wants to know if they can, uh, directly print aligners, because it's a pain in the neck to have to suck them down after you print the model out. Um, so I wonder if you can tell us a little bit more about the biomechanics of directly printing 3D memory aligners. Thank you. Um, I was looking at the pictures behind Richie.
I didn't see my picture there. I hope
you put mine in there. Mr. Richie graduated in 1975. from Yukon from our second class and then his son graduated also Zach from our Yeah, it is. I'm one of my closest, uh, friends over the years. Just think of it. Almost what almost 50 years now Richie, uh, every (00:24:00) orthodontist can make direct printed aligners.
Direct printed aligners is very simple. The 3D printing takes only about 32 minutes. It goes into the centrifuge to take all the resin out for another four minutes. Then you put it into the curing area where under the nitrogen it is going to cure for about 20 minutes. It comes out, you put it in the boiling water because see there is no, uh, no resin left.
You take it out and you are, the aligners are ready. And, and at this time, a typical printer, the one we use Unix. May gives us about 8 to 10 aligners and these aligners you give them to the patient and you, once you show it to the patient, they love it. All you do is you put it in a warm water. It becomes very soft, like (00:25:00) putty.
You put it in the mouth, adapt it, press it, and it's no overhangs, no nothing. And then you, you are in business from that point on. Patients love it. Patients love it because they are not taking it out more. Most of the time when they change aligners for first two days, there's an overhang and they are making bubbles when they talk with saliva.
They pull it out. So I think it's, it's, uh, they will love it. Orthodontists will love it. Patients are going to love it. But I think it's going to take time, a lot of teaching, a lot of, uh, explaining to people. I will be speaking again on this subject at, uh, AAO meeting in New Orleans. And, uh, Dr. Ki Bum Kim from, who's chairman in St.
Louis, he is also speaking there. And, uh, as Leon told me that there's a little commercial part in here. (00:26:00) And if you haven't bought this book, I think you should all have this book. Oh, wait a minute. Where is it? There it is. Yeah. The only problem is, uh, uh, every time they print it, as they get printed, it sells out.
So I get calls from, I can't find the book. I can't find the book. So, you know, it's all on aligners. And we have a new book coming out also on aligners, which will have a lot of exciting things also. So it keeps you busy.
(00:26:31) Dr. Leon Klempner: Ravi, you're like a marketing machine over here. We're impressed by this. This is great.
Listen,
(00:26:36) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: this is what, once you retire, that's all you do. You know, you, I live on, I live on a golf course, you know, before I coming here, I went to practice a little bit because I haven't played golf in a few days. So it's a good life.
(00:26:55) Dr. Leon Klempner: But time is running out, but I do want to squeeze in one last question.
And (00:27:00) that is, uh, it all seems almost too good to be true, right? I mean, it's, yeah, the environmental aspect of it, the, um, the benefits to the patient, the force controls, the, uh, it's like, it's like, like you said, it's revolutionary. Like, like what Naitai Wires to brackets and bands, but there's got to be some downsides to it.
So tell me what, what are the limitations or what are the downsides as you see it?
(00:27:32) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: The downside I only see is, uh, uh, human created. Okay. Now some of the people. When they have not followed the process completely, uh, then they will say, Oh, you know, I had a patient, uh, he complained about, uh, there was a little bit of a lip swelling.
So I said, did you, how, what was the process? Did you take all the, all the, uh, (00:28:00) uh, Resin out, uh, yes, but how did you cure it? Oh, I used, uh, glycerine, uh, and I used microwave. Uh, so whenever people try to do a shortcut, they're going to run into problems. You know, that's the way I look at it. And the other thing is, as we move along, we are going to...
streamline the process a little bit more, make it more user friendly, make it more, more, more easier. So you will see that this is just the beginning of the whole thing. Resin is not going to change. 3D printing is not going to change. The only thing people have to be careful of is Follow the instructions.
Otherwise it's not going to work. There are no shortcuts as simple as that.
(00:28:50) Amy Epstein: Sounds like with any new technology, you have to learn how to use it. And, uh, when you do, it can work really well for you.
(00:28:56) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: I am using iPhone for 20 years or 18 years. I (00:29:00) still don't. I have to ask my wife.
(00:29:04) Amy Epstein: Cause you had to, you have to go through the learning process.
Dr. Nanda, it's, uh, your, your advice, you know, well, listen, thank you so much. This has been, it's been delightful talking with you. We really appreciate it. If our listeners want to learn more about, uh, the technology, if they want to contact you, ask any questions, what's the best way for them to reach out?
(00:29:27) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: I think the best way to reach, uh, reach me personally is going to be that they have to send me an email very soon.
I'm going to have first time in my life. I'm going to have a website also because my wife says you gotta have a website. So I have a website. They can get in touch with me. Um, I think the best way to get in touch with me is, uh, through Instagram and Facebook. Uh, because then I can talk with them and give them my email and see who's (00:30:00) who, because I don't want to get a phone number here or email here.
I'll have so many of them. Uh, I have on Facebook about 17, 000 people who follow me in the orthodontic study group. And same about 17, 18, 000 on Instagram also. And, uh, so I do post a lot of courses, lectures, all the articles and Progress in Orthodontics is now the number one journal in orthodontics. It's the highest impact factor journal and, uh, and it's free and it's on online.
Everybody can access it and, uh, you know, we publish for 45 to 50 articles a year. And, uh, so that keeps me busy. So, Instagram, Facebook, Ravi Nanda, that's
(00:30:52) Amy Epstein: the name. We'll find you there. We'll find you there. And I know we can look at your Wikipedia
(00:30:57) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: page, too, if you want. Are you on Instagram?
(00:30:59) Amy Epstein: Good. (00:31:00) Yeah, I'm on Instagram.
The business, that's what we do, you know? Oh, he's on Instagram. Very good. Influencer in the making over here.
(00:31:11) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: So, so where is this going to be, uh, broadcast?
(00:31:16) Amy Epstein: I'm so glad that you asked. This is the next thing I'm going to say. So you, our listeners are going to be able to subscribe. To get all of our episodes, including this one on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, SoundCloud, YouTube, wherever you listen to a podcast or watch a video podcast is where you'll be able to see this one and the other ones that we've done in the past.
Um, and we always say to those listeners that are watching this show, that if you enjoyed it today and listening to Dr. Nanda and us talk about new technologies, we appreciate you telling a colleague. And just like you have a website, we have a website. You can see more about people in practice, which is the company my (00:32:00) dad and I started together by visiting PPL practice.
Dot com. So Dr. Nanda, thank you for joining us today. It's been a pleasure. We look forward to talking with you again and seeing you at the A A O because we will be listening to your lecture for sure. Thank you. And I wanna know if you will come to the one that I'm giving, because I'm gonna give you lecture there as well.
(00:32:19) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: I'll be, and thank you. And can you please, uh, give the link to on my Instagram and Facebook so people can Absolutely,
(00:32:26) Dr. Leon Klempner: oh yeah. We'll, your podcast absolutely. Absolutely. That
(00:32:31) Dr. Ravindra Nanda: will be my part as
(00:32:34) Dr. Leon Klempner: an podcast. Love it. No problem at all. Yep. Yep. That sounds good. Okay. I want to thank everybody. I want to thank Ravi.
I want to thank everybody for listening and watching. Um, at People in Practice, we are, of course, a full service marketing agency, but I'm always proud to say that we speak ortho. Uh, if you'd like to contact me, uh, with any marketing questions, shoot me an email Leon at pplpractice. (00:33:00) com. Remember for forward thinking orthos, it's never been a better time to be an orthodontist.
We are in the golden age. Take advantage of it. Bye for now.
(00:33:11) Narrator: Thank you for tuning in to the Golden Age of Orthodontics. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or visit our website at thegoldenageoforthodontics. com for direct links to both the audio and video versions of this episode.
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